Record Store Day can elicit surprises that are often unexpected. I often heard of the Bleeding Hearts and anticipated in the fullness of time that the finished album would sonically appear to bookend Bob Stinson’s storied career and ultimately also shine a light on the hot ember that existed for a short period of pulse, cadence, and measure. Well, the hands of time have been bent back, the past is the future and that future is now. Bleeding Hearts are one of those bands that imploded before they had lifted off. The release of Riches To Rags will finally put them in their rightful place in Minneapolis' storied musical history.
Stinson should be familiar to most reading this (Replacements, Bleeding Hearts, Static Taxi), however the band also contained a future Magnolia in Mike Leonard. I had the opportunity to convey a few questions over a few [online] beers with Mike Leonard. This is what transpired.
Riches to Rags will be released on blood red yinyl with liner notes by Bob Mehr (Trouble Boys) on April 23, limited to 2,220 copies and a digital release at a later time. The surviving members with also be performing on April 23 at Eagles Lodge (2507 E. 25th Street in Minneapolis, MN) to commemorate this historical offering.
Scene Point Blank: How did this release come to fruition? Was it truly forgotten about and, lastly, was it always your hope it would see the light of day? Essentially why has it sat on the “cutting room floor”?
Mike Leonard: It was mixed and mastered in ‘93-‘94 and ready for release, however after I kicked Bob out of the band and then subsequently joined the Magnolias it got moved to the back burner. As it turned out, The Magnolias moved to Boston for a few months and when we returned to Twin Cities, John Freeman (Magnolias) and I both moved into a house that Sunshine was renting. This would have been the summer of ‘94. We were still talking about releasing it then, I would even see Bob from time to time and he expressed the same sentiment: “Just put it out!” Then he, sadly, passed away the following year and the record spent a quarter-century in purgatory.
Scene Point Blank: How involved were you in its release?
Mike Leonard: Sunshine did all the leg work as far as reaching out to Bar None and getting them involved. From there I was involved. I had the master tapes, I took one of the masters to Eddie Ciletti for him to transfer to digital. I brought in Jacques Wait and worked with him on a couple of remixes and then he remastered the record. I reached out to Bob Mehr about writing liner notes, which he so graciously did. He and I have remained in touch ever since he wrote Trouble Boys, he’s been a good friend. It’s been a real pleasure working with Bar None and Sunshine on the entire project.
Scene Point Blank: Was Bob Stinson fully amenable to joining the band when you first approached him or was there some lag time for him to make his decision? Did it take some convincing? Believe this all happened at the Uptown Bar? Did he join the band first and then become your roommate (chicken before the egg question)?
Mike Leonard: He definitely dragged his feet initially. At first, he thought this other guitar player would be a better fit for us. After an initial attempt at playing with Bob didn’t really go that well, we took Bob up on this and he introduced us to another guy that we ended up playing with for about 9 months. I think Bob saw us a couple of times during that span, and after the other guy moved Bob was really gung-ho about joining.
Scene Point Blank: As a roommate were you the “Felix” to his “Oscar”?
Mike Leonard: I didn’t really consider Bob a roommate. He was more like an Oscar that slept on my couch. He didn’t really have a job during that time, so he didn’t pay rent. Kinda amazing that lasted as long as it did!
Scene Point Blank: A lot has been written about Bob Stinson. How would you describe Bob, his personality, playing in a band with him and perhaps living with him?
Mike Leonard: He was like a big kid. Quick wit, always trying to one-up you. We had a lot of laughs. One time he walks in and says, “Hey you can use this joke if you ever come across two guys, one named Bob and one named Neil. Say to them, are those your names, or is that what you do?” And I ask him, what’s your middle name Bob? And he rather sheepishly replies, “Neil.”
Scene Point Blank: Did you not play with Bob prior on a track for a band he was in: Static Taxi?
Mike Leonard: That actually happened after he had joined the Bleeding Hearts. But yes, one night Ray from Static Taxi wanted to get Bob into the studio for this song called “We Do” and they wanted to use our space to jam with Bob. So, I agreed but for some reason ended up at the space with them and ended up playing with them. They liked playing Stones songs so we jammed all night, Bob walked all the way home from Saint Paul.
Scene Point Blank: What led to the demise of Bleeding Hearts and Stinson’s departure?
Mike Leonard: I can’t remember if he moved out of my place prior to leaving the band, but the two weren’t far apart. The band continued as a three-piece and with a couple of other guitar players, then kind of morphed into a different band. The ‘90s are kind of a blur!
Scene Point Blank: How long did it take to record Riches to Rags? Was this always intended to be the title of the LP or was there a working title? Do you have many memories of the recording process as a whole?
Mike Leonard: The album title was a last minute decision, there had been other ideas floated back in the day. I thought it would have been funny to call it Let it Bleed!
It only took a couple of weeks to record. We went into Terrarium Studio in March of ‘93 and recorded 8 songs, mostly live. And finished those pretty quickly. Then we went back in August and recorded 5 more, more or less the same way. One night, Bob was overdubbing a guitar part, it was hot and he takes his shirt off and from our vantage point in the booth, it looked like he was buck naked playing guitar. It was pretty funny. A lot of things happened before cell phone cameras.
Scene Point Blank: What records were you and Stinson spinning when you were not rehearsing? Were any of them largely influential to the band at the time?
Mike Leonard: Bob set up this wall of stereo speakers in the living room and would rumble the whole building. He loved Johnny Winter and he would play these mixed tapes he would get from Peter Jesperson. One band he got me into at the time was Urge Overkill. I woke one morning and he kept listening to the intro “What’s this generation coming to?” by them, and the sound of the needle getting picked up and back down was deafening. He was so excited about Blackie’s drum part on that song.
Scene Point Blank: Do you still own the records that Stinson “borrowed” and sold, only to buy back and return to you? (possibly not the same ones that were borrowed)? Ha ha
Mike Leonard: Actually a few, I think. I recently got a new turntable and got all my records out. And there are so many random records! Then I’ll be like, “Where’s my Abbey Road? Oh, Bob!”
"We played so loud back then that, usually, the sound pressure would be too much for the microphones."
Scene Point Blank: Will the stuff you recorded on 4-track at your practices ever see the light of day?
Mike Leonard: I doubt it. If there was a way to make it sound decent I would consider it. We played so loud back then that, usually, the sound pressure would be too much for the microphones.
Scene Point Blank: What are your thoughts on Record Store Day and, from there, your feelings around this being released with limited supply? Do you happen to know how many copies are being pressed? I understand that it will have a cd/digital release later. Lastly, are you still a collector yourself and still pursuing any illusive Rolling Stones bootlegs?
Mike Leonard: These follow-up questions are great, haha!
We’ll see how it goes, it would be great if there is demand for another pressing. There were 3000 shipped worldwide to stores.
I still have some of those Stones bootlegs, I don’t know what I was thinking about paying $40-50 for those things. The best ones have been remastered and released properly.
Scene Point Blank: Are you involved with any musical projects currently?
Mike Leonard: The Magnolias are planning on heading back to Spain later this year. I’ve been doing some recording lately as well.
Scene Point Blank: Do you remember what combination of amp and guitar you used for the Bleeding Hearts recording?
Mike Leonard: Yes, I had wanted to use my 50-watt Hiwatt...but Tommy recommended an old Supro Model 24, a similar circuit to what Jimmy Page used on Zeppelin I…and my 59 Les Paul Junior. I used a few guitars on the record, I had a B-Bender Tele, another old Tele, and ‘57 Les Paul Special. I used that for the solo on “Happy Yet.”
Scene Point Blank: Apparently, the last recording Johnny Thunders did was with a German band called Die Toten Hosen. When it was time for Thunders to pick an amp for the rendition of “Born To Lose” he dug through a pile of amps and pulled out the smallest, shittiest amp even though Die Toten Hosen let him know they had much better amps on hand.
Did Bob Stinson not do something similar? Was that for the recording of Bleeding Hearts? Do you recall what guitar he primarily used for the recording?
Mike Leonard: Bob had this amp that was all spray painted -- I think it was an old Yamaha…something trashy but, in the studio, he ended up playing through a Marshall. I can’t remember which specific head it was, but it would have been a good one, maybe a JCM 800 or an old plexi? I believe he played a Strat for most of the record, but he may have had a Gibson Explorer (?) for the second session.
Scene Point Blank: How did you end up joining The Magnolias? Are there plans for another Magnolias recording? Other than Spain are there plans to tour?
Mike Leonard: I was with them in Chicago. The Bleeding Hearts had played on a bill with them and we were all at the same warehouse party after. The next morning when everyone woke up and asked, “Where’s Lischmann?”
Johnny [O’Hallorin] says, “He left.” They had evidently gotten into an argument. So, I had the day to learn their set before we drove to Kansas City the next night for another show.
There aren’t any immediate plans to record, although I’ve been cajoling John to do something now that my studio is pretty dialed in. Off the Hook just was just reissued in France. So, who knows, maybe we can do an EP or something before this fall?
